A forum for artists who paint with Water Soluble Oils
 
HomeHome  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  RegisterRegister  Log in  

Share | 
 

 How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
Janet
Moderator
avatar

Posts : 2050
Join date : 2009-11-15
Location Location : North Bay, Ontario Canada

PostSubject: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:06 pm

As per Winsor & Newton:

"When Artisan is thinned with water, the water evaporates from the paint film fairly rapidly, leaving behind a conventional film of oil that dries by means of oxidation. The different drying rates of Artisan colours are due to the different reaction of each pigment when mixed with oil. Winsor & Newton formulate each colour individually to optimise its drying rate, helping artists to avoid the problems of slow drying underlayers. However, the following list is a guide to the likely variations:

Fast drying (around 2 days)

Prussian Blue, Umbers.

Medium Drying (around 5 days)

Cadmium Hues, Phthalo Blue (red shade) and Phthalo Greens, Siennas, French Ultramarine, Synthetic Iron Oxides, Ochres, Titanium White, Zinc White, Lamp Black, Ivory Black.

Slow drying (more than 5 days)

Cadmiums, Permanent Rose (quinacridone), Permanent Alizarin Crimson."

_______________________________________________
Janet
http://janet-coloredpencil.blogspot.com/
Back to top Go down
dlspinks

avatar

Posts : 42
Join date : 2009-11-23
Location Location : North Carolina

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Mon Nov 23, 2009 12:23 am

It's important to note that the WN rep is referring to "touch dry", not varnish-ready dry. Once the water evaporates, you have left regular oil paint that takes 6-12 months to thoroughly oxidize, depending on factors such as number and thickness of the layers and individual pigment drying rates. The rates listed above are for the rates to get a layer touch dry enough to add another layer without lifting or mixing. Addition of mediums and, particularly, oils can increase this touch dry time. Varnishing shouldn't be done until at least a few months after the painting is complete. For example, I usually paint in 3-4 thin layers and varnish at 6 months.
Back to top Go down
Janet
Moderator
avatar

Posts : 2050
Join date : 2009-11-15
Location Location : North Bay, Ontario Canada

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Mon Nov 23, 2009 8:17 am

Good point Debra! Thank you for bringing that up!

_______________________________________________
Janet
http://janet-coloredpencil.blogspot.com/
Back to top Go down
judyfilarecki
Moderator
avatar

Posts : 2685
Join date : 2009-11-16
Location Location : Northern NY and Southern Arizona

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Mon Nov 23, 2009 12:00 pm

Thanks Janet and Debra,

I always wondered about the drying time for specific colors. It sure is helpful actually having a reference now instead of just guessing.
judy

_______________________________________________

judy-filarecki.artistwebsites.com***filarecki.com ***judyfilarecki.hubpages.com/
Back to top Go down
dbclemons



Posts : 154
Join date : 2009-11-16
Location Location : Texas

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Mon Nov 23, 2009 3:26 pm

I recommend testing swatches of your colors to find out how quickly they dry. I've seen lists of some pigments described as "average" drying that took forever to dry in masstone, especially ultramarine. Ivory or lamp blacks are also slow drying pigments, as are the Quinacridones. The cadmiums are more what I'd call average, and anything with manganese or cobalt will dry fairly quickly.

The surface you paint on will also affect your drying (more absorbant or porous will increase the rate,) and some pigments use slower drying oils than linseed, or include dryers in the paints also. There are also mediums you can add to alter the rate, or how thin the paint is. All sorts of variables.
Back to top Go down
Janet
Moderator
avatar

Posts : 2050
Join date : 2009-11-15
Location Location : North Bay, Ontario Canada

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Mon Nov 23, 2009 4:17 pm

Thank you David for the extra info on drying times. Good advice regarding the swatches. Good point regarding the surface affecting he drying time. Smile

_______________________________________________
Janet
http://janet-coloredpencil.blogspot.com/
Back to top Go down
kbaxterpackwood

avatar

Posts : 93
Join date : 2010-01-22
Location Location : Iowa

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:17 pm

Anyone know what the drying time of W&N's Payne's Grey is?
Back to top Go down
Callie
Moderator
avatar

Posts : 1233
Join date : 2009-11-21
Location Location : St. Louis, MO USA

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Tue Feb 23, 2010 8:30 pm

I use a lot of payne's grey, but usually mixed with other colors, so I never noticed how fast/slow it dries. I've got some on my palette from earlier this afternoon - I'll keep an eye on it and see how it goes. Maybe someone else might have an answer...
Back to top Go down
Janet
Moderator
avatar

Posts : 2050
Join date : 2009-11-15
Location Location : North Bay, Ontario Canada

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Wed Feb 24, 2010 8:41 am

Payne's Gray is a combination of PBk6-Lamp Black and PB29 Ultramarine Blue; therefore, I would think that the average drying time would be about 5 days as that's the average for the individual pigments.

_______________________________________________
Janet
http://janet-coloredpencil.blogspot.com/
Back to top Go down
Gumsandals



Posts : 2
Join date : 2010-03-28

PostSubject: Drying time between layers   Sun Mar 28, 2010 2:58 pm

dlspinks wrote:
It's important to note that the WN rep is referring to "touch dry", not varnish-ready dry. Once the water evaporates, you have left regular oil paint that takes 6-12 months to thoroughly oxidize, depending on factors such as number and thickness of the layers and individual pigment drying rates. The rates listed above are for the rates to get a layer touch dry enough to add another layer without lifting or mixing. Addition of mediums and, particularly, oils can increase this touch dry time. Varnishing shouldn't be done until at least a few months after the painting is complete. For example, I usually paint in 3-4 thin layers and varnish at 6 months.
Hi, I just started using w/s oils and wonder if it's true that I can quickly add another layer after spraying a coat of retouch varnish between them (after the first layer has dried to the touch). Supposedly, it adds a "skin" between the two layers and keeps the older layer from lifting up while it is still drying and you're painting on top of it. I've tried it on a few parts of my painting and it seems to be working, but I have my doubts, i.e., somewhere down the road, maybe months from now, cracks and other horrible things will appear because I didn't wait long enough for the whole layer to dry and not just the surface. As I understand it, this approach forgives any breach of the fat over lean rule. That's why I've turned to this forum for reassurance that it's okay to proceed with this approach. Please advise. Thanks, Gumsandals
Back to top Go down
Callie
Moderator
avatar

Posts : 1233
Join date : 2009-11-21
Location Location : St. Louis, MO USA

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Sun Mar 28, 2010 7:34 pm

Welcome to the forum, Gumsandals!
I've always heard that this is not a good thing to do, but never researched it; although I paint in layers, I use an alkyd medium (to quicken the drying) and I wouldn't want to add anything that might interfere with it. No need to complicate things! Anyway - this is from a Gamblin newsletter about varnishing:

A typical oil painting is made with a palette of artists' grade oil colors. Each color has different oil to pigment ratio and is used with varied amounts of painting medium. As a painting dries, parts of the painting look glossy and some look matte. Many artists want to even out these differences in the MIDDLE of the painting process.

There are two traditional techniques that have been used for centuries to deal with this.
One is the use of retouch varnish. We discourage the use of retouch varnish within paint layers because even a very thin coat of varnish adds soluble material in between paint layers.
The retouch layer may interfere with the paint layers bonding together.

A better method that we recommend is called "oiling out." To deepen or enliven color during the painting process apply a very thin layer of oil, or your painting medium to those "sunken" areas. Apply the medium; wipe it all off except for a thin layer. Then paint right into this layer before it dries. This technique puts a real paint layer inside the painting so all layers will bond together as one.

Here's a link to the article:
http://www.gamblincolors.com/newsletters/studionotes11.html

Back to top Go down
Janet
Moderator
avatar

Posts : 2050
Join date : 2009-11-15
Location Location : North Bay, Ontario Canada

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Mon Mar 29, 2010 7:47 am

Hi Gunsandals! Welcome! I did read about someone using the artisan water soluble oils and making their retouch varnish by mixing 1/2 W&N Thinner and 1/2 W&N Water Mixable varnish. I can't speak from personal experience with retouch varnish but from researching it I do know that their are a lot of artists who use it in the same way you're describing. Also some artists use the retouch varnish as a temporary varnish if they plan to sell the painting before the 6 months that it would take to apply a final varnish. They just arrange to contact the customer in 6 months to add the final varnish.

My process is what Callie describes except I use 1/2 water with 1/2 linseed oil (Holbein brand) to create a couch to paint into. I do feel that in order to avoid any problems down the road I wouldn't use a retouch varnish. I did read that retouch varnish yellows over time. So with everything Callie pointed out and the yellowing factor I wouldn't risk it when oiling out is a simpler solution anyway. Smile

_______________________________________________
Janet
http://janet-coloredpencil.blogspot.com/
Back to top Go down
Gumsandals



Posts : 2
Join date : 2010-03-28

PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:03 am

Thanks for the quick response. Good advice and something to think about.
Gum
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?   

Back to top Go down
 
How long does it take for Water Soluble Oils to dry?
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» Water to run our engines
» Water pump
» Burrell 4" - help required re getting water from tank to boiler
» 4" water bowser\cart
» 2” Burrell water Gauge – new builders note

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
 :: Painting Discussions :: Water Soluble Oils-
Jump to: